[Todd]

I just got of the phone with a pretty well know formulator who works for a major wax producing company. I'm not going to drop names and I don't know if what he told me is 100 percent accurate, but I though it would make for an interesting discussion.

I asked him about high percentage carnuaba waxes, specifically P21s 100, Zymol, and Swissvax. I asked if there was any benefit. His response was that no modern wax contains more then 10 percent carnuaba wax by volume. I asked him to explain.

When a company like Zymol tells you that they have 80 percent carnuaba wax, they are referring to the percentage of carnuaba in the amount of wax. That is, if the wax makes up 15 percent of the volume, then 80 percent of that wax is carnuaba. He went on to say that some older waxes (he named some old school brands that I never heard of) used as high as 30 percent wax in the old days, but the solvents needed to cut the wax are pretty wild and not enviromentally friendly.

Carnuaba is harder then concrete in natural forum and has to be softened and cut to be used in liquid or paste form. With modern California VOC regulations, I was told that it is basically impossible to get more then 10 percent carnuaba volume with out the use of harsh, fast drying solvents. These harsh, fast drying solvents are what create a "hard" feel to the wax, such as Meguiars #16.

Also, Carnauba wax is not glossy. Not at all, it is very cloudy and opaque and doesn't reflect light very well. It is the oils and solvents added to the 'nuba that produce the "nuba look" not the nuba itself. Also, while 'nuba wax does have great protective abilities, it melts at 139 degrees and once cut with sovlents, evaporates rather quickly. Most of the actually wax content is gone from the surface of the car pretty quickly. Its the oils, silicones, and solvents that stay behind and maintain the look, long after the wax is gone.

The last point that he made was that there is no such thing as white or pure carnauba wax. Over 99 percent of the carnauba wax harvested comes from a small area in Brazil, and for it to be commerically avialabe, it has to be #1 standard. #1 Standard is in reference to the color, which is a yellowish adobe color. Compaines claiming to use white carnauba are bleaching the wax to alter its color. It is also cheap, at roughly 5 dollars for 10lbs, when bought in bulk.

FWIW, I haven't done any research, but I do trust this guy. Like I said, he works for a major wax company (not sealant, but wax) and has helped forumlate carnauaba waxes for several pretty big companies world wide.

Just food for thought.

[Cooter]

Sounds interesting. More marketing at its finest seems like.

[Todd]

I don't know, I have used some high end nuba and loved them. I love Souveran/PS21 and despite logic, will try and probably love Swissvax as well. From my experience, a lot of everything is hype, but is how you feel after you use it, and what it does for YOU that matters the most.

[Cooter]

Yeah. Have to agree with you there Todd. The finished product and liking what it looks like has alot of appeal to it. I love Souvie too. I'm waiting on my Victoria's Concours. Should be here tuesday. I have no idea when i'll get to try it out either. Hopefully soon!

[DieselMDX]

good stuff

[klumzypinoy]

Thanks for the story, really interesting.

[JohnyB]

Ty for shareing.

[togwt]

I've posted some info on Carnauba wax in a new thread as it's rather long (yes I know, very unusual for me.

Honest opinion or merely advertising? Commercialism brings with it concerns of honesty and true representation. In other words, it’s difficult to know what is true when someone is motivated by income, i.e. directly targeted at product sales, more so than an unbiased opinion

I would also strongly suggest that you verify any information that I or anyone else shares with you.

[Nica]

Interesting feed back, I personally prefer to use the high end products. One thing I've noticed about wax products from different price range is it's quality oooh but keep in mind I'm no chemist nor know much about wax just the little bit I read but I've used quite a number of them and I know what I'm looking for.

I first started using Souveran, I went from Mothers three step system and I thought I was achiving wicked results hahahaha oh those were the days. Well now that I know the true meaning of detailing finding a good quality wax took me quite some time. I've tried a few Zymol wax products, some cheap wax and so far I've got up to Vintage...and the one thing I noticed is the depth and shine each wax gives. Oh but I agree preperation is very important, I mean no point on putting Vintage on a vehicle that is full of swirls we all know that.

But having good preperation and using Vintage for example gives the vehicle that extra umph, makes that vehicle pop but the other benefit of using such a product is it's durability. Well I've noticed Vintage seems to last quite a bit longer compared to the other wax's I've used. Example I enjoy using the Victoria wax's and to be honest they are quite nice and will continue to use them but they don't last as long as Vintage but then again I don't think it's fair to compare Victoria to Vintage, not a fair comparison that's all.

Well but I agree with you Todd it comes down to personal taste, I've used Vintage and to be honest it left me wanting more. There is nothing wrong with Vintage but I just want more then Vintage so I steped up to Swissvax Divine and considering Zymol Royale...are they worth the money who knows but I can afford it and would love to add Royale to my collection

[agentf1]

Swissvax says 51% or 60% by volume right in their descriptions. I am pretty sure Zymol uses the same type of descriptions so I am guessing that means the other 40% are solvents, oils or other types of wax such as beeswax etc...