[trhland]

thats funny. ive seen that before and it still makes me laugh

[HPIA4v2]

Originally Posted by trhland

thats funny. ive seen that before and it still makes me laugh

That's when Swissvax and Zymol comes in, they experiment with catalyst to blend more-more nuba but keep it in paste form (not brick). I heard montan oil is known to be used.

If that's not true than all high end waxes are just snake oils.

[Rubbish Boy]

Originally Posted by HPIA4v2

I heard montan oil is known to be used.

Montan oil is mentioned on a lot on Zymol reseller sites, in lists of ingredients, but what is it? There is no mention of it anywhere other than on Zymol related sites, even chemical manufacturers I have asked have no idea what it is.

[Cooter]

Pure Carnauba assumes a rock-like hardness and must be softened before it can be applied. Most competitive waxes use harsh petrochemical solvents to soften the Carnauba, but these solvents also re-enter the paint potentially softening the paint. Montan oil is a natural solvent derived from the sap of the German Coal Black Evergreen tree. The oil is removed from the sap, spun and distilled to make the Carnauba spreadable. Because it is highly spun (very thin) it allows the Carnauba to enter and fill in microscopic scratches on the painted surface yet will not react with the paint itself.

Found this on drivewerks.com after doing a search on montan oil on google. Dont know if its right or not, but it was talking about Z**** waxes

[Rubbish Boy]

Originally Posted by Cooter

Pure Carnauba assumes a rock-like hardness and must be softened before it can be applied. Most competitive waxes use harsh petrochemical solvents to soften the Carnauba, but these solvents also re-enter the paint potentially softening the paint. Montan oil is a natural solvent derived from the sap of the German Coal Black Evergreen tree. The oil is removed from the sap, spun and distilled to make the Carnauba spreadable. Because it is highly spun (very thin) it allows the Carnauba to enter and fill in microscopic scratches on the painted surface yet will not react with the paint itself.

Found this on drivewerks.com after doing a search on montan oil on google. Dont know if its right or not, but it was talking about Z**** waxes

And that's all I have ever found out about it too. Now try and find out what a German Coal Black Evergreen tree is. All that comes up is the same text about montan oil on Zymol related sites. Perhaps they are growing their own species of trees now?

[Cooter]

Montan wax - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Tried Montan wax this time. No mention of any tree!

[Dom]

Originally Posted by HPIA4v2

That's when Swissvax and Zymol comes in, they experiment with catalyst to blend more-more nuba but keep it in paste form (not brick). I heard montan oil is known to be used.

If that's not true than all high end waxes are just snake oils.

Montan wax is basically a black 'coal wax' as used in shoes polishes. If you take Montan oil as beings its liquid derivative, you would logically have coal oil - oil derived from fossil deposits deep underground... sounds familiar... I think you could ask any Saudi or Texan about this subject Petrochemical oils and solvents are actually quite common as your gas station attendant will tell you.

In my early experiments I used the harshest and most aggressive solvents known - industrial thinners that can melt plastic within minutes - and they basically had minimal effect on softening carnauba beyond standard solvents. Talk of magic ingredients and techniques needs to be independently verified as it goes against common knowledge and chemistry. The fact is that measuring by dry volume gives the high percentages often claimed, as does measuring carnauba as a proportion of wax content only, or measuring carnauba as a proportion of solids content after solvent evaporation (ie what is left on your bodywork). These are justified scientifically, but make up your own mind whether they are justified from a marketing perspective

[trhland]

Originally Posted by Dodo Factory

Montan wax is basically a black 'coal wax' as used in shoes polishes. If you take Montan oil as beings its liquid derivative, you would logically have coal oil - oil derived from fossil deposits deep underground... sounds familiar... I think you could ask any Saudi or Texan about this subject Petrochemical oils and solvents are actually quite common as your gas station attendant will tell you.

In my early experiments I used the harshest and most aggressive solvents known - industrial thinners that can melt plastic within minutes - and they basically had minimal effect on softening carnauba beyond standard solvents. Talk of magic ingredients and techniques needs to be independently verified as it goes against common knowledge and chemistry. The fact is that measuring by dry volume gives the high percentages often claimed, as does measuring carnauba as a proportion of wax content only, or measuring carnauba as a proportion of solids content after solvent evaporation (ie what is left on your bodywork). These are justified scientifically, but make up your own mind whether they are justified from a marketing perspective

tryed emailing swissvax to ask them just for my couriosity. about how they measure there carnauba. but for some resone my email wont go through?hmm not sure if its my computer or not. anyone have an idea.

[Rubbish Boy]

Originally Posted by Cooter

Montan wax - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Tried Montan wax this time. No mention of any tree!

If you take it as a play on words, German Coal Black Evergreen tree. Montan Wax comes from Lignite coal which is a particluar type of coal from the fossilised remains of Evergreen trees, that come from the German black forest. Lignite oil which is also derived from this coal is also known as mineral oil, also known as paraffin oil. A very common and not very sexy sounding ingredient that makes a very good solvent in car waxes. Of course that's just me playing with the words.

[Cooter]

Its like National Treasure. One clue leads to another and another and another.